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	<title>Comments on: MMORPGs &amp; Instant Gratification</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/</link>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/comment-page-1/#comment-314446</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Mar 2011 11:02:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/#comment-314446</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s different levels of instant gratification between genres of gaming.

That there&#039;s MMOs Anonymous, and numerous sites offering ways to tackle MMO addiction, it speaks volumes about this particular genre.  Whilst the OP here is not affected, there&#039;s thousands out there battling this very real addiction.

I think we all realise that there&#039;s instant gratification in all games, but to what extent is the question to ask, and how and when does it become a problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s different levels of instant gratification between genres of gaming.</p>
<p>That there&#8217;s MMOs Anonymous, and numerous sites offering ways to tackle MMO addiction, it speaks volumes about this particular genre.  Whilst the OP here is not affected, there&#8217;s thousands out there battling this very real addiction.</p>
<p>I think we all realise that there&#8217;s instant gratification in all games, but to what extent is the question to ask, and how and when does it become a problem.</p>
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		<title>By: Openedge1</title>
		<link>http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/comment-page-1/#comment-4268</link>
		<dc:creator>Openedge1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 14:06:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/#comment-4268</guid>
		<description>No
You&#039;re wrong

Cause you spelled your wrong...it is You&#039;re

Cheers</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No<br />
You&#8217;re wrong</p>
<p>Cause you spelled your wrong&#8230;it is You&#8217;re</p>
<p>Cheers</p>
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		<title>By: Qix</title>
		<link>http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/comment-page-1/#comment-4098</link>
		<dc:creator>Qix</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Jul 2008 03:32:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/#comment-4098</guid>
		<description>Quoting Aaron:
&quot;Basically, the problem is that we need MMOs from people who couldn’t give a rat’s ass what current MMO designers are doing.&quot;

Exactly!

I had no problems having fun in Ultima Online, EverQuest, ShadowBane or GemStone 3.  Those games did not revolve around quests, hell I think EQ was the only game listed there that even had quests.

Since WoW the basic simplicity of entire MMO&#039;s is getting to me as well, not just the quests.  Playing up until you make final level without ever talking to another character is just not right.  I play an MMO over single player RPG for the social aspect.  Not to solo the entire game until raids...
The next generation of MMO needs to use the social aspect of the game much more.

The best example I have is an old MUD originally on AOL, Gemstone III. When you killed something, the EXP went into a &#039;bucket&#039;.  That bucket can only hold so much EXP.  So at some point it becomes full.  The bucket slowly drains of exp, into your actual character, like an hourglass.  This drain is much slower than it takes to kill things.  This lets people go to town, chat, have fun with friends and guild, all while still, technically gaining EXP.  So long as you go back out to hunt before the buckets empties, you never stopped gaining exp.  Also, in town center&#039;s, and tavern&#039;s, etc, this bucket emptied faster.  I see the inherent problem of a graphical MMO having problems with a  lot of people gathering together, but there are multiple ways to remedy this. (more taverns/inns, include guildhalls to the list)

Another thing Gemstone did:  group buffs.  They lasted 15(?) minutes, but they also stacked, so if you cast it 8 times, it lasted 2 hours.  Many people made a living out of casting group buffs for entire rooms of up too 100 people thanks too small tips.  Its a small thing,  but it made you be a little more social.  You saw the same people giving buffs, started to learn their names, said &quot;Hello&quot; when you saw them elsewhere.

As teh article, and Aaron both say, MMO&#039;s need to stop being a job (Daily quests?   WTF?!), and start being about fun. Actually require some skill, and become social again.

PS  GREAT ARTICLE.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Quoting Aaron:<br />
&#8220;Basically, the problem is that we need MMOs from people who couldn’t give a rat’s ass what current MMO designers are doing.&#8221;</p>
<p>Exactly!</p>
<p>I had no problems having fun in Ultima Online, EverQuest, ShadowBane or GemStone 3.  Those games did not revolve around quests, hell I think EQ was the only game listed there that even had quests.</p>
<p>Since WoW the basic simplicity of entire MMO&#8217;s is getting to me as well, not just the quests.  Playing up until you make final level without ever talking to another character is just not right.  I play an MMO over single player RPG for the social aspect.  Not to solo the entire game until raids&#8230;<br />
The next generation of MMO needs to use the social aspect of the game much more.</p>
<p>The best example I have is an old MUD originally on AOL, Gemstone III. When you killed something, the EXP went into a &#8216;bucket&#8217;.  That bucket can only hold so much EXP.  So at some point it becomes full.  The bucket slowly drains of exp, into your actual character, like an hourglass.  This drain is much slower than it takes to kill things.  This lets people go to town, chat, have fun with friends and guild, all while still, technically gaining EXP.  So long as you go back out to hunt before the buckets empties, you never stopped gaining exp.  Also, in town center&#8217;s, and tavern&#8217;s, etc, this bucket emptied faster.  I see the inherent problem of a graphical MMO having problems with a  lot of people gathering together, but there are multiple ways to remedy this. (more taverns/inns, include guildhalls to the list)</p>
<p>Another thing Gemstone did:  group buffs.  They lasted 15(?) minutes, but they also stacked, so if you cast it 8 times, it lasted 2 hours.  Many people made a living out of casting group buffs for entire rooms of up too 100 people thanks too small tips.  Its a small thing,  but it made you be a little more social.  You saw the same people giving buffs, started to learn their names, said &#8220;Hello&#8221; when you saw them elsewhere.</p>
<p>As teh article, and Aaron both say, MMO&#8217;s need to stop being a job (Daily quests?   WTF?!), and start being about fun. Actually require some skill, and become social again.</p>
<p>PS  GREAT ARTICLE.</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron</title>
		<link>http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/comment-page-1/#comment-4095</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 21:53:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mmocrunch.com/2008/07/11/instant-gratification-rant/#comment-4095</guid>
		<description>Agreed. But the problem isn&#039;t the quest system, or the loot system, or any other system that commonly rears its head in MMOs. The problem is the fundamental design philosophy that drives the games and is more focused on retaining subscribers than creating fun.

Basically, the problem is that we need MMOs from people who couldn&#039;t give a rat&#039;s ass what current MMO designers are doing.  Mythic and SOE are making admirable changes right now, but not enough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed. But the problem isn&#8217;t the quest system, or the loot system, or any other system that commonly rears its head in MMOs. The problem is the fundamental design philosophy that drives the games and is more focused on retaining subscribers than creating fun.</p>
<p>Basically, the problem is that we need MMOs from people who couldn&#8217;t give a rat&#8217;s ass what current MMO designers are doing.  Mythic and SOE are making admirable changes right now, but not enough.</p>
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